Ex-Goldman Sachs Vice President: 8 Things You Should Know Before Hitting The Apply Button

[TheReformedInvestor1]

The hiring process at GS is extremely selective, but also misunderstood. Here are 8 things you should know about applying to one of the most coveted firms in banking.

1. Be ready for the long haul!
It is not uncommon to sit through 20, 30 interviews for a position. Not only will you meet every members of the team, but you should expect to meet the team heads several times, your future counterparts on other continents, and the partner(s) of the business. Why? Many insiders believe that the sum of objectivities tends toward objectivity. But also because you’ll be a ‘node’ in a system, interacting with dozens inside and outside of your business. They must all agree on working with you. Hence the second point…

2. The process is surprisingly collegial.
You will be interviewed by fairly junior people (even if you apply for a senior role)… Don’t make the mistake of seeing these conversations as ‘validation interviews’, arranged out of courtesy to younger members of the team. Their vote will count. Once a part of the team, you will be assessed on how you work with them even if you are above them. Treating younger members of the team poorly can really set you back.

3. A multi-cultural background helps a lot.
A lot of recent joiners have double diplomas, one in their home country, and one in another country, with one of the two taught in English. For instance, a business diploma from Bocconi in Italy and a Law degree from Durham. It makes a lot of sense: London is still the bank’s hub for Europe, so in-depth knowledge of at least one other European country is good for business. Worth noting: knowing the language is nice to have, but certainly not enough. Let's face it - being able to order a croissant in Paris won't get you, or your team, very far. Instead, several years with a diploma will show another important thing about you. The banking industry changes constantly, and long careers require adaptability. So if you have proven that you can be parachuted in unknown territory, learn the ropes, and thrive, then you will do well.

4. Being an expert in your field gives no guarantee to get an offer.
Did you write a PhD in risk premia in Emerging Asia? Good for you (I guess), but don’t overestimate the benefit this is giving you in the recruitment process. Why? Because the firm has world class experts in a lot of fields around the globe and, unlike in a lot of other workplaces, if you are one of them there’s an expectation that if someone, somewhere asks you for a 30 minute call on your subject of expertise, you must make room in your schedule to answer their questions. The upside: once you've joined there are a lot of internal resources you can tap. When you apply, your specialisation won’t be a game changer if it doesn’t come with the right mindset and soft skills.

5. It is essential to prove your teamwork abilities.
I know, I know – every bank claims that teamwork is vital. But GS takes it really, really seriously. If you are very successful at the expense of your team (or just difficult to work with), you won’t do as well as you would have hoped, and perhaps you’ll be better off elsewhere. This is something that is often misunderstood about the firm's culture. Someone very successful once said that they preferred people from BU (Boston University) to Harvard, because BU emphasizes teamwork a lot more. Ability to build something with others prevails over individual brilliance.

6. Look for potential mentors.
Perhaps your future mentor is among the people interviewing you. Again, this is an important part of a career at the bank. Mentors play a key role in your career, and in internal mobility. Most of the successful people at GS have benefited from mentors that have helped them with training, opportunities internally, and contacts. So if you get someone senior to see good mentee potential in you, as early as during the recruitment process, that’s probably going to help a lot. Try to steer the conversation towards a mentor/mentee conversation… If you interviewer starts giving you advice or telling about something he or she has learnt, your interview is going well!

7. Internal mobility matters; show that you are ready for it.
A lot of successful careers inside the bank have taken place in different locations – London, New York, and Tokyo. Just look at the CVs of the current management. London, Tokyo, Hong Kong… They are all over the world. International mobility will not only allow you to know your industry or enlarged product team better, but they could give you a chance to start new activities in new markets (for instance, the one you were a part of in your original location, but which was non-existent in your new location). That’s good for the firm, and good for you. Stating your intention to work in other regions, done with subtlety, will show commitment, and a desire to grow.

8. Float product ideas or process improvements.
Try to think of a product or process that could help the business of the team you are applying for. It may sound silly at first, but some of the best ideas were launched by fairly junior members who went on to do great things. Read for instance interviews of Julian Salisbury who joined in Product Control but found a way, through technology, to make his own job redundant. His boss didn’t fire him: he gave him bigger challenges instead.

Best of Luck!

 

[JustAnotherHuman1]

What are some of the most common negative feedback you hear when assessing candidates? It'd be good to know what are some things to avoid as there must be some patterns that repeat over and over again. Or is it just a case of simply not having a strong enough profile/interpersonal skills?

 

[TheReformedInvestor1]

Nothing to do with skillsets - by the time they get past HR, all the candidates were impressive. Ability to work with the team was definitely a common reason... but more often a candidate had both the IQ and social skills line up. After a couple of (interview) rounds, you could see consensus emerging on one person.

 

[magellan1]

I agree that the ability to work in a team is important but I wouldn't dismiss individual personality, skills and knowledge. There are few people like Cristiano Ronaldo and you might not like them but they are valuable because they tend to be more talented, have worked harder, made sacrifices and/or invested much more resources for their personal development compared to the other people.

 

[HowardM1]

The hiring process at GS is extremely selective, but also misunderstood. Here are 8 things you should know about applying to one of the most coveted firms in banking.

1. Be ready for the long haul!
It is not uncommon to sit through 20, 30 interviews for a position. Not only will you meet every members of the team, but you should expect to meet the team heads several times, your future counterparts on other continents, and the partner(s) of the business. Why? Many insiders believe that the sum of objectivities tends toward objectivity. But also because you’ll be a ‘node’ in a system, interacting with dozens inside and outside of your business. They must all agree on working with you. Hence the second point…

2. The process is surprisingly collegial.
You will be interviewed by fairly junior people (even if you apply for a senior role)… Don’t make the mistake of seeing these conversations as ‘validation interviews’, arranged out of courtesy to younger members of the team. Their vote will count. Once a part of the team, you will be assessed on how you work with them even if you are above them. Treating younger members of the team poorly can really set you back.

3. A multi-cultural background helps a lot.
A lot of recent joiners have double diplomas, one in their home country, and one in another country, with one of the two taught in English. For instance, a business diploma from Bocconi in Italy and a Law degree from Durham. It makes a lot of sense: London is still the bank’s hub for Europe, so in-depth knowledge of at least one other European country is good for business. Worth noting: knowing the language is nice to have, but certainly not enough. Let's face it - being able to order a croissant in Paris won't get you, or your team, very far. Instead, several years with a diploma will show another important thing about you. The banking industry changes constantly, and long careers require adaptability. So if you have proven that you can be parachuted in unknown territory, learn the ropes, and thrive, then you will do well.

4. Being an expert in your field gives no guarantee to get an offer.
Did you write a PhD in risk premia in Emerging Asia? Good for you (I guess), but don’t overestimate the benefit this is giving you in the recruitment process. Why? Because the firm has world class experts in a lot of fields around the globe and, unlike in a lot of other workplaces, if you are one of them there’s an expectation that if someone, somewhere asks you for a 30 minute call on your subject of expertise, you must make room in your schedule to answer their questions. The upside: once you've joined there are a lot of internal resources you can tap. When you apply, your specialisation won’t be a game changer if it doesn’t come with the right mindset and soft skills.

5. It is essential to prove your teamwork abilities.
I know, I know – every bank claims that teamwork is vital. But GS takes it really, really seriously. If you are very successful at the expense of your team (or just difficult to work with), you won’t do as well as you would have hoped, and perhaps you’ll be better off elsewhere. This is something that is often misunderstood about the firm's culture. Someone very successful once said that they preferred people from BU (Boston University) to Harvard, because BU emphasizes teamwork a lot more. Ability to build something with others prevails over individual brilliance.

6. Look for potential mentors.
Perhaps your future mentor is among the people interviewing you. Again, this is an important part of a career at the bank. Mentors play a key role in your career, and in internal mobility. Most of the successful people at GS have benefited from mentors that have helped them with training, opportunities internally, and contacts. So if you get someone senior to see good mentee potential in you, as early as during the recruitment process, that’s probably going to help a lot. Try to steer the conversation towards a mentor/mentee conversation… If you interviewer starts giving you advice or telling about something he or she has learnt, your interview is going well!

7. Internal mobility matters; show that you are ready for it.
A lot of successful careers inside the bank have taken place in different locations – London, New York, and Tokyo. Just look at the CVs of the current management. London, Tokyo, Hong Kong… They are all over the world. International mobility will not only allow you to know your industry or enlarged product team better, but they could give you a chance to start new activities in new markets (for instance, the one you were a part of in your original location, but which was non-existent in your new location). That’s good for the firm, and good for you. Stating your intention to work in other regions, done with subtlety, will show commitment, and a desire to grow.

8. Float product ideas or process improvements.
Try to think of a product or process that could help the business of the team you are applying for. It may sound silly at first, but some of the best ideas were launched by fairly junior members who went on to do great things. Read for instance interviews of Julian Salisbury who joined in Product Control but found a way, through technology, to make his own job redundant. His boss didn’t fire him: he gave him bigger challenges instead.

Best of Luck!

All sounds like good advice, I would add to your point no 4 about "thinking" your an expert in anything.

Probably in the eye's of GS you are not, unless its bleeding edge, in which case they are probably speaking to you because of that. If you going for some kind of general intake humility is key. You "might" be the future "Ronaldo" in your field but you most certainly are not at this moment in time, at least not in GS's eye's, these guys have everyone from ex politicians, CIA and Nobel Laurates on their payroll. Nothing turns off an interviewing more than a whiff of entitlement imho.

Point 6 about mentoring is good, I would add try to build a rapport with some of your interlocuters if possible, be human, be relaxed, show that you can fit in and interact, try to show your intelligence in a lateral fashion rather than via what's on your resume. Most of the partners I have met from GS are interesting people, they are not all nice people, but they are interesting!.

Finally think about why you think you want to work at GS if its simply about the money maybe think again, its not an easy gig, and for many it probably does not pay all that well when you take into account the hours.